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Sean



Joined: 29 Mar 2004
Posts: 1442
For those who can't wait for Tuesday to find out . . .  Reply with quote  

There's a way to find out on Sunday.

http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2004/football/nfl/10/28/bc.fbn.redskins.politic.ap/index.html
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Post Thu Oct 28, 2004 9:57 am   View user's profile Send private message
Dave



Joined: 24 Aug 2004
Posts: 451
Location: MA, USA
 Reply with quote  

Anybody else catch the new South Park this week? Seems they're pretty much in line with the AG on this one..

Post Thu Oct 28, 2004 8:25 pm   View user's profile Send private message
Kurt
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Vote or Die?  Reply with quote  

Douche or Turd?

Will we know the result on November Turd?

Who among us will be banished?

Will our vote really matter?

Will our vote even be counted? (Already 58,000 Absentee ballots lost in Florida; Registration forms trashed in Ohio)

Turn in next week, Same Batter Up Time, Same Batter Up Channel?

Post Thu Oct 28, 2004 9:15 pm   
Plastique Jesus



Joined: 29 Oct 2004
Posts: 27
Smile  Reply with quote  

Hi folks,
First post. Just wanna say cheer up Chris. If this election is the prelude to Armageddon that it feels like, at least we have a front row seat. Shocked

For some Halloween scares, go to ronaldreagen.com. The repubs there are fairly nice, and seem intelligent, but you wouldn't believe the flavor of Koolaid they're drinking. I once had a conversation with a super smart scientist on that board who was a supporter of "Young Earth Creationism". It baffels my mind that someone so smart could be so stupid. That's how I feel about many of my Bush supporting friends. I'm from Kansas City Kansas, so my presidential vote is pointless (red state and all) but I'll trudge out to the polls anyway so I can try and put a few liberals in power locally.

HELP US, SWING STATE VOTERS...YOU'RE OUR ONLY HOPE!!
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Post Fri Oct 29, 2004 8:26 am   View user's profile Send private message
Think insane.



Joined: 26 Apr 2004
Posts: 1577
Location: Night's Plutonian shore
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Chris, you are only human, just like the rest of us, and it would be stupid and selfish of us to expect you to be there for our amusement all the time. I started liking you as my favorite author. Since I've started coming to your site, I've started liking you as a pretty good all around guy that happens to write some terrific, humorous, highly enjoyable books. Your job is to write a book every once and a while, not keep us entertained 24/7. You are just as entitled to your bad days, weeks and months as anyone else.

I sympathize with you, as I to have had my retch level pegged by this election, although for different reasons. I can honestly say, I've never been more disgusted by the political situation in this country. I'm sure I'm going to get flamed for what I'm about to say, but I really don't give a fuck, cause I'm pissed off. I need to get it off my chest, because the closer it gets to election day, the more I am deluged by stupidity and people that can't step back from their party line and look at the big picture.

If the Democrats really and truly wanted to beat George Bush, they would have ran a candidate that was worth a shit. It shouldn't have taken much to beat Bush, really. Think about it. Most republicans would, I think, rate him a mediocre president at best. Only the diehards would ever say he was a great president and mean it, a very vocal minority of the party. Instead of screaming ridiculous accusations, like this whole draft thing, the Dems should have stuck to the facts, outlined them very clearly and concisely, and ran a field of candidates that would represent the PEOPLE of this country, and not a party. Republicans are no different than Democrats: If you appeal to the moderates from the other party, they will more than make up for your own fanatic fringe that you alienate.

And that being said, the Republicans should by all rights be doing the same thing. There is no reason why an incumbent president has to get the nomination. They should have thrown George W, Bush right the fuck out the door and ran some one that was worth a shit. But instead, we get stuck with this dick for a candidate, because they think it's the best chance they have to remain in power. It's not about this country, it's not about the people, it's about the two major parties need to keep power.

Well, I don't give a fuck what's best for the Democratic and Republican parties. I give a fuck about what's best for this country, and the people that live in it. I want my choices for leader to be the best possible choices. I want an election where I know the winner is going to do right by the constituency, which many seem to have forgotten is every single citizen of the United States of America. I don't want to have to constantly choose between the lesser of two evils.

I think a lot of people let their energy be misdirected in this campaign. Instead of foaming at the mouth with foolishness like "anyone is better than Bush" (anyone that believes that is really true is so fucking naive it's not even funny, because there are far more dangerous people out there clamoring for power), would have been well served to use that energy to force their party to present a candidate that would unseat GWB with little or no effort, due simply to the fact that he's not a total jerk off. They are YOUR parties, and you need to take back control. And I need to also. Iím just as guilty. I did nothing but sit back and get annoyed, but not so annoyed I was willing to do anything about it. Fro that, I am remiss.

I'll tell you, I've met Terry McAuliffe, and his main motivation is what's best for Terry McAuliffe, not how best to achieve the social reforms that the Democratic Party claims to represent. I have no idea who the chairman of the GOP is, but I have no problem believing, sight unseen, that he's a dick too. All those people that have spent months foaming at the mouth about Bush should have been DEMANDING that their party put forth a candidate that would soundly beat Bush on MERIT and nothing else. They would have used their time much more wisely than posting hysterical nonsense on the internet and vandalizing my fucking car.

I know the populace of this board is fairly liberal, and the majority are most definitely anti-Bush, so does anyone really think it would have been hard to beat Bush on merit? I certainly don't, and I'm a registered republican. And yet, it would appear that John Kerry either can't, or will just barely beat the worst sitting president since Woodrow Wilson. How the fuck does that happen? Can you honestly tell me that there was no better man out there? When it gets to the point where a representative of the NAACP is paying someone in crack cocaine to falsify voter registration forms with Mary Poppins name just to try and ensure Kerry wins, thatís a fuckiní problem, a pretty serious one. It doesnít fill me with confidence. If these two douche bags are the best that can be offered, we might as well roll up the sidewalks and go back to the old country because there is no hope.

I had decided some months ago that I was going to be a contentious objector in this election. For the first time in my life, I was going to forfeit my vote, and I have voted in every election, from school board to president, since I was eighteen years old. But, as it grows near, I realize that I canít in good conscience do that. I will cast a vote, but I will not be casting a vote for the lesser of two evils. I will spend the time from now to election day looking for a person that I feel truly and honestly would represent this country and do what is in itís best interest. I will write that person in for my vote for President. I will never again allow two self-serving organizations throw shit in my face because thatís in there best interest. And after Tuesday, I will get involved, and I will spend the next four years trying to get others to force change on a system that serves itís own interests, and not the interests of the people it purports to represent.

Iíve gotten a lot from this country, far more opportunity than I would have if I had stayed in Northern Ireland. I respect the sacrifice that has been made in its name. I once took an oath to defend it, and I thought that adjudicated my obligation. I was wrong. I truly believe the obligation is lifelong, because if we donít take responsibility for our country, if we donít step up and say enough of this bullshit, we have lost our freedom. No matter what happens Tuesday, Iím going to try and make a change. Iíll put as much effort as I can into that, to try and force the current political parties to represent the people and not their own interests. If Bush wins Iím not going to go into drama queen hysterics about Armageddon, and if Kerry wins, Iím not going to cry about how we will be crushed under the boot of terrorism. Iíll live my life as I always have, and I will try and make a change for the better.

Feel free to go ahead and start bashing me now. I donít give a shit anymore.
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Post Sun Oct 31, 2004 12:59 am   View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Visit poster's website AIM Address
chris
Site Admin


Joined: 02 Mar 2004
Posts: 3833
Location: People Republic of Northern California
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Well, TI, that certainly was passionate, and not completely insane. I'm not really a party guy myownself, and as I've said here a number of times, I registered to vote in 2000 so I could vote for McCain, because despite the many issues on which I disagree with him, there are also many with which I agree (campaign finance, balanced budget), but more because I thought the guy really had a set on him. In fact, one of the more nauseating things about this election is watching McCain toady to Bush on the campaign trail.

But I don't agree that Kerry is the worst we have. Early in the primaries, really early, he got my support when he went public and said, "Now that we have overthrown one oppressive regime, it's time to overthrow the oppressive regime in our own country." I e-mailed him that day, in the spring of '03, offering my support, because I thought he had a set on him to say that in the midst of all the rah-rah bullshit that was going on all over this country. People celebrating our guys killing thousands of Iraqis like it was a good thing.

Is Kerry the best? I don't know. He seems the best that we were offered. Howard Dean had some interesting ideas, and he's certainly smart, but I'm not sure he could have gotten elected.

The reason that Kerry is having a hard time beating Bush is because there is a built in advantage for the incumbent, and because people are frightened. As irrational as it may be, people are frightened, and they like sameness when they are frightened. Sameness feels safer.

I'm all for reforming the system, doing away with the electoral college, changing to the system of run-offs used by many countries, but that's not going to happen in our lifetime. We are stuck with this archaic system left over from a time when a galloping horse was the fastest means of communication and the governement didn't want to trust the election to the will of a bunch of non-property owning men.

Clinton wouldn't have won in '92 if not for Perot, and W wouldn't have won in 2000 if not for Nader. Until the system is reformed, the outside candidate does nothing more than foil the will of the people. And the congress is not going to draft a constitutional amendment to change the system because they are the system. Was it Locke who said, "A government exists to perpetuate itself"? Or something along those lines, and Locke was the go-to guy that Jefferson and Madison based our governement on. No one is going to reliquish a system he's mastered.

I completely understand your anxiety, and it's akin to my own, but I do see the lesser of two evils as a viable choice. I am an artist, the right of free expression is my life blood, and if Bush had his way, this country would be a theocracy. (Fallwell and Robertson support him, need I say more.) You think that a book like Lamb is going to be easy to obtain in a theocracy? I write about religion and faith, all the time, I get faith, I respect faith, but I cannot support a leader who allies himself with those who would restrict the rights of others because of their faith. (Not to mention putting the button in the hand of a man for whom the culmination of his faith is the end of the world and who believes he is doing God's work.) And that's just the faith part. Don't get me started on the stupid part. Don't get me started on the environment part. And don't get me started on the fiscal responsibility part. What conservative spends into deficit like that?


So, yeah, in my lifetime, I've felt it's generally been, vote "no" for president, but not this time. And my anxiety comes from the thought that Bush may be elected. There may be doubts about Kerry, but there are no doubts about Bush. I've seen his shit, I don't need to see a sequel to know I don't like it.

Ah, well, only three more days. Or three more days and four years. Either way, I don't think your thoughts will garner the flames you anticipate. We all get the frustration. Really.

Post Sun Oct 31, 2004 2:14 am   View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Visit poster's website
Think insane.



Joined: 26 Apr 2004
Posts: 1577
Location: Night's Plutonian shore
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I agree with just about everything you said (although, I will be truthful, I have never had much use for John Kerry, and that's from long before he threw his hat into the presidential ring). I'm also right there with you on McCain. I campaigned for him in the primaries, and I am saddened to see him kow-towing to Bush now. Rudy Giuliani too.

As far as the flames go, it might just be that I am severely sleep deprived and cranky, or more likely the reaction those same sentiments have gotten me elsewhere. I know you guys function at a higher level than most of the people I deal with, in real life and on the net, so it was unfair to think that I wouldn't be able to put forth my thoughts on the subject without you guys being able to discuss it like adults. You all are much better than that.

I posted a similar rant on another message board last night, and a guy replied with a link to an eminem video and "Watch this video and tell me that doesn't change your mind about who to vote for". Well, the day that I let a fucking tube steak like eminem be the deciding factor in who I vote for to lead this country is the day I'll rip up my own voter registration card.

And I think that's one of the things I found most disgusting about this election, the amount of people that seem to be taking their cues from celebrities about who to vote for. I give about as much of a shit who Alice Cooper endorses as I do eminem. I like Tim Robbins movies a lot, but I don't think that gives him any special insight into the world of politics.

All gratuitous ass kissing aside, I appreciate and respect your opinions because you always put them across as YOUR opinion, Chris Moore, the regular Joe, living in an impenetrable island fortress, just like regular folks, and not "I'm Christopher Moore, and my book is the number on pick on Booksense, so you really need to heed my political opinions!Ē You always come off as an ordinary citizen with valid concerns and fears about the out come of the election that happens to be a famous and worldly writer guy. At least for me, your opinion gets a lot more mileage that way, then if I was expected to assign extra importance to it do to your status as a cultural icon ( cultural icon, THAT was the gratuitous ass kissing).

Anyway, I'm starting to get loopy from lack of sleep, and I still have three more hours to go, so I'll continue in this conversation tomorrow after some rest. Otherwise, the gibberish is just going to keep getting gibberishier.
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"It's like he channels dead crazy people."
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thinkinsane at mac dot com
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Post Sun Oct 31, 2004 2:47 am   View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Visit poster's website AIM Address
chris
Site Admin


Joined: 02 Mar 2004
Posts: 3833
Location: People Republic of Northern California
 Reply with quote  

Think insane. wrote:

your opinion gets a lot more mileage that way, then if I was expected to assign extra importance to it do to your status as a cultural icon .



Dood, please, I'm wearing a Tele-Tubby suit.

Post Sun Oct 31, 2004 3:15 am   View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Visit poster's website
Think insane.



Joined: 26 Apr 2004
Posts: 1577
Location: Night's Plutonian shore
 Reply with quote  

That's why you're a cultural icon. What, did you think it was the books?

Mr. Green
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Post Sun Oct 31, 2004 4:10 am   View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Visit poster's website AIM Address
John



Joined: 02 Mar 2004
Posts: 521
Location: Massachusetts
 Reply with quote  

Quote:
from Chris:
I registered to vote in 2000 so I could vote for McCain, because despite the many issues on which I disagree with him, there are also many with which I agree (campaign finance, balanced budget), but more because I thought the guy really had a set on him. In fact, one of the more nauseating things about this election is watching McCain toady to Bush on the campaign trail.


McCain is the guy I would have voted for as well, I sent him an email about 3 months ago, about when the shit-slinging really stepped up a notch in the election, and basically said how much I admired him and that I understood about his party loyalty but enough was enough. I begged him to stand up and confront the president on his numerous and flagrant abuses of his power.

About 5 days later, McCain did indeed come out and harshly critisize President Bush and his campaign. Now I'm not saying I had anything to do with that, but I can hope.

But your right, Chris. Seeing him on the road campaigning for Bush is twisting my stomach into knots. I don't pretend to know what pressures one's political party can bring to bear on you if you are a senator, but it is dissapointing to find out that McCain is indeed just a run of the mill politician.

We are never going to get anywhere if we keep electing politicians to office.
The person most qualified to be president is the person who wants the job the least.

WE need a Cincinnatus
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Post Sun Oct 31, 2004 9:35 am   View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Visit poster's website AIM Address
Jillybeans



Joined: 02 Sep 2004
Posts: 2247
Location: Cambridge, Massachusetts
 Reply with quote  

You gentlemen are probably going to get mad at me for saying this but ALRIGHT ALREADY!!! Chris and Think, this is coming from somebody with the name of Jillybeans (deceiving isn't it?), LIGHTEN UP. Worrying is one of my favorite pastimes, I do it well and I'm always pleasantly surprised when what I'm worried about doesn't happen. Well that, and taking those little plastic arrows with the suction cups and shooting them at the TV whenever Bush or Cheney come on the air. Takes care of the anxiety and my aim IS getting better.

All kidding aside, I don't think Bush will be reelected and I KNEW the Sox were going to win. How does that work with a majority of democrats and responsible Republicans in the House or Congress, how much power do you think Baby Bush's administration will have not only in this country but globally. My two cents and now I'll go away for a little while. Cool Bye.

Post Sun Oct 31, 2004 11:36 am   View user's profile Send private message
Kurt
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Rippin posts dudes ...  Reply with quote  

Think ... and CM ... you should both be proud.

Your posts were thoughtful and thought-provoking, and not just a collection of Sound-Bytes that say nothing.

They are what today's politcal process should be, and the candidates, the media, and the process-as-practiced should be ashamed. They are not worthy to stand in your shadow, or the shadow of your posts.


But how far back am I going to have to go to find one of MY posts that are longer? Mr. Green Mr. Green Mr. Green Mr. Green Mr. Green

Post Wed Nov 03, 2004 5:49 pm   
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