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Some ideas and such!

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Oliverbritten



Joined: 01 Mar 2008
Posts: 119
Some ideas and such!  Reply with quote  

I am writing a story and I have most of the plot worked out, but I am wondering whether it would not been beneficial to have a romance or relationship of some sort. Firstly this is a vampire story, and vampire romance is a bit overdone right now. to put this in more context my story is a sort of modern day Oliver twist, but with a vampire twist. There is an older man who takes care of a bunch of vampire kids and a couple of human kids until he can find or figure out a cure for their vampirism while they are being hunted by the man they were taken from who is dieing so he wants to use the vampire blood to make him live forever because he is scared of dieing. So far all the vampires are boys but I was wondering whether having a girl in their would add anything. These are the choices I see so far, feel free to add any others.

1. There is a girl vampire kid at the start.

2. The girl is a local human girl who found where the kids were hiding and when she got scared and ran she was bitten and turned into a vampire.

3. No vampire girl at all

4. Human girl.

The story so far is pretty much oliver twist, with the older man being the fagin character because he takes care of the kids, but he asks them to bring him food and other supplies as well because he knows they only need blood to survive so he lets them get their blood as long as they can bring him and the other humans with him supplies so they can live. I think I posted this story in a different thread, but this time I am actually writing the story rather than just thinking of writing it.


Last edited by Oliverbritten on Wed Apr 15, 2009 1:07 am; edited 1 time in total

Post Wed Apr 08, 2009 12:16 am   View user's profile Send private message
chris
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Strangely enough, romance adds tension. I only read the first Harry Potter book, but I remember immediately wondering whether Hermoine (sp?) and Harry or Ron would "like" each other. Same thing with the Golden Compass, she has a best "male" friend, who she goes to the end of the earth to find. We're hard-wired that way. I don't like the way they just tack romances on to movies, and they often don't fit so I wouldnt' go there if it doesn't seem natural for your character, but finding a companion or mate is very often a part of character motivation, and can work to add a lot of tension to a story. Understand that as a mechanism, romance works better if it's about the pursuit. Nothing kills a TV series as quickly as the two main characters getting together, and often the writers will have to break them up again and again. (Dr. Who and Rose never really "hook up", but their adventure is certainly a romantic one.) Tom Sawyer has a "love interest" in Becky Thatcher. Huckleberry Finn doesn't. Huckleberry Finn is the better book.

If it will add to the effect of the story, then pursue it. With "kid" characters, it can be a lot more clean and pure and unstated, than it is with adult characters. It might not even be "a romance", but a stealthy romantice interest. It's all about satisfying the reader and serving the story you want to tell.

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sugarraydodge



Joined: 27 Nov 2007
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My goal for my next novel is for there to be no love angle. My first two books had heavy love themes, and my third had a more subtle love angle. I think Chris is right that it adds tension and works well if it serves the story. But it seems like there is love in almost every story these days. I don't even know what I'm writing about next, but I am planning on there being no love angle at all just to see if I can restrain myself.
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Post Wed Apr 08, 2009 4:14 am   View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website AIM Address
Oliverbritten



Joined: 01 Mar 2008
Posts: 119
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chris wrote:
Strangely enough, romance adds tension. I only read the first Harry Potter book, but I remember immediately wondering whether Hermoine (sp?) and Harry or Ron would "like" each other. Same thing with the Golden Compass, she has a best "male" friend, who she goes to the end of the earth to find. We're hard-wired that way. I don't like the way they just tack romances on to movies, and they often don't fit so I wouldnt' go there if it doesn't seem natural for your character, but finding a companion or mate is very often a part of character motivation, and can work to add a lot of tension to a story. Understand that as a mechanism, romance works better if it's about the pursuit. Nothing kills a TV series as quickly as the two main characters getting together, and often the writers will have to break them up again and again. (Dr. Who and Rose never really "hook up", but their adventure is certainly a romantic one.) Tom Sawyer has a "love interest" in Becky Thatcher. Huckleberry Finn doesn't. Huckleberry Finn is the better book.

If it will add to the effect of the story, then pursue it. With "kid" characters, it can be a lot more clean and pure and unstated, than it is with adult characters. It might not even be "a romance", but a stealthy romantice interest. It's all about satisfying the reader and serving the story you want to tell.


One of my problems with having any kind of romance in this story, is that not only have vampire romance stories been done before but one focused around kids has been done not too long ago. That isn't going to stop me writing the story, but I think having the relationship between the 2 characters who have a slight hint of romance even if it is innocent be one that is only hinted at and more ambiguous. Kinda like the first harry potter book like you said with Hermione. If I was to include the romance part I wonder if having the girl vampire start out as a vampire and a character at the start of the story would have more or less of an impact compared to if she starts out as a human girl who is turned by one of the kids. I really don't want it to seem thrown in just because vampire romance is popular. To make my story different I would probably have to have something in the relationship that makes it different compared to the others.

Post Wed Apr 08, 2009 7:58 am   View user's profile Send private message
18Rabbit



Joined: 21 May 2008
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Location: WTF is wrong with you?
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Oliverbritten wrote:
chris wrote:
Strangely enough, romance adds tension. I only read the first Harry Potter book, but I remember immediately wondering whether Hermoine (sp?) and Harry or Ron would "like" each other. Same thing with the Golden Compass, she has a best "male" friend, who she goes to the end of the earth to find. We're hard-wired that way. I don't like the way they just tack romances on to movies, and they often don't fit so I wouldnt' go there if it doesn't seem natural for your character, but finding a companion or mate is very often a part of character motivation, and can work to add a lot of tension to a story. Understand that as a mechanism, romance works better if it's about the pursuit. Nothing kills a TV series as quickly as the two main characters getting together, and often the writers will have to break them up again and again. (Dr. Who and Rose never really "hook up", but their adventure is certainly a romantic one.) Tom Sawyer has a "love interest" in Becky Thatcher. Huckleberry Finn doesn't. Huckleberry Finn is the better book.

If it will add to the effect of the story, then pursue it. With "kid" characters, it can be a lot more clean and pure and unstated, than it is with adult characters. It might not even be "a romance", but a stealthy romantice interest. It's all about satisfying the reader and serving the story you want to tell.


One of my problems with having any kind of romance in this story, is that not only have vampire romance stories been done before but one focused around kids has been done not too long ago. That isn't going to stop me writing the story, but I think having the relationship between the 2 characters who have a slight hint of romance even if it is innocent be one that is only hinted at and more ambiguous. Kinda like the first harry potter book like you said with Hermione. If I was to include the romance part I wonder if having the girl vampire start out as a vampire and a character at the start of the story would have more or less of an impact compared to if she starts out as a human girl who is turned by one of the kids. I really don't want it to seem thrown in just because vampire romance is popular. To make my story different I would probably have to have something in the relationship that makes it different compared to the others.

I think you worry too much about what other people have written. Tell your characters story and be true to them and sod the rest.

Post Wed Apr 08, 2009 8:40 am   View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website
Oliverbritten



Joined: 01 Mar 2008
Posts: 119
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18Rabbit wrote:
Oliverbritten wrote:
chris wrote:
Strangely enough, romance adds tension. I only read the first Harry Potter book, but I remember immediately wondering whether Hermoine (sp?) and Harry or Ron would "like" each other. Same thing with the Golden Compass, she has a best "male" friend, who she goes to the end of the earth to find. We're hard-wired that way. I don't like the way they just tack romances on to movies, and they often don't fit so I wouldnt' go there if it doesn't seem natural for your character, but finding a companion or mate is very often a part of character motivation, and can work to add a lot of tension to a story. Understand that as a mechanism, romance works better if it's about the pursuit. Nothing kills a TV series as quickly as the two main characters getting together, and often the writers will have to break them up again and again. (Dr. Who and Rose never really "hook up", but their adventure is certainly a romantic one.) Tom Sawyer has a "love interest" in Becky Thatcher. Huckleberry Finn doesn't. Huckleberry Finn is the better book.

If it will add to the effect of the story, then pursue it. With "kid" characters, it can be a lot more clean and pure and unstated, than it is with adult characters. It might not even be "a romance", but a stealthy romantice interest. It's all about satisfying the reader and serving the story you want to tell.


One of my problems with having any kind of romance in this story, is that not only have vampire romance stories been done before but one focused around kids has been done not too long ago. That isn't going to stop me writing the story, but I think having the relationship between the 2 characters who have a slight hint of romance even if it is innocent be one that is only hinted at and more ambiguous. Kinda like the first harry potter book like you said with Hermione. If I was to include the romance part I wonder if having the girl vampire start out as a vampire and a character at the start of the story would have more or less of an impact compared to if she starts out as a human girl who is turned by one of the kids. I really don't want it to seem thrown in just because vampire romance is popular. To make my story different I would probably have to have something in the relationship that makes it different compared to the others.

I think you worry too much about what other people have written. Tell your characters story and be true to them and sod the rest.


I would still write the story even it was too similar to something else. The only reason I am thinking of similarities is not because of what people think of the quality of the story, more how it is received by the people who could publish it once I get it done. Then again I dont know what those people usually think having had no experience with them so I probably am worrying too much. I also would like something in the relationship between characters to be a bit different not because of what people would think really, its more that I would find it more personally compelling to write. Then again if I can't think of anything too different then I will just write what works for me.

Post Wed Apr 08, 2009 11:27 am   View user's profile Send private message
chris
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Oliverbritten wrote:
18Rabbit wrote:
Oliverbritten wrote:
chris wrote:
Strangely enough, romance adds tension. I only read the first Harry Potter book, but I remember immediately wondering whether Hermoine (sp?) and Harry or Ron would "like" each other. Same thing with the Golden Compass, she has a best "male" friend, who she goes to the end of the earth to find. We're hard-wired that way. I don't like the way they just tack romances on to movies, and they often don't fit so I wouldnt' go there if it doesn't seem natural for your character, but finding a companion or mate is very often a part of character motivation, and can work to add a lot of tension to a story. Understand that as a mechanism, romance works better if it's about the pursuit. Nothing kills a TV series as quickly as the two main characters getting together, and often the writers will have to break them up again and again. (Dr. Who and Rose never really "hook up", but their adventure is certainly a romantic one.) Tom Sawyer has a "love interest" in Becky Thatcher. Huckleberry Finn doesn't. Huckleberry Finn is the better book.

If it will add to the effect of the story, then pursue it. With "kid" characters, it can be a lot more clean and pure and unstated, than it is with adult characters. It might not even be "a romance", but a stealthy romantice interest. It's all about satisfying the reader and serving the story you want to tell.


One of my problems with having any kind of romance in this story, is that not only have vampire romance stories been done before but one focused around kids has been done not too long ago. That isn't going to stop me writing the story, but I think having the relationship between the 2 characters who have a slight hint of romance even if it is innocent be one that is only hinted at and more ambiguous. Kinda like the first harry potter book like you said with Hermione. If I was to include the romance part I wonder if having the girl vampire start out as a vampire and a character at the start of the story would have more or less of an impact compared to if she starts out as a human girl who is turned by one of the kids. I really don't want it to seem thrown in just because vampire romance is popular. To make my story different I would probably have to have something in the relationship that makes it different compared to the others.

I think you worry too much about what other people have written. Tell your characters story and be true to them and sod the rest.


I would still write the story even it was too similar to something else. The only reason I am thinking of similarities is not because of what people think of the quality of the story, more how it is received by the people who could publish it once I get it done. Then again I dont know what those people usually think having had no experience with them so I probably am worrying too much. I also would like something in the relationship between characters to be a bit different not because of what people would think really, its more that I would find it more personally compelling to write. Then again if I can't think of anything too different then I will just write what works for me.



Oliver, I know you're striving for originality, but publishers almost never reject something because they've "seen it before". They often reject things because they haven't. Sad but true. Just write the best story you can. Think only of the integrity of YOUR story.

Are you actually writing this, or thinking about writing it?

Post Wed Apr 08, 2009 12:05 pm   View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Visit poster's website
18Rabbit



Joined: 21 May 2008
Posts: 1734
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As the characters grow and reveal themselves to you (at least that's how it is when I write), the relationship will become more clear to you. If I were in your place I would leave the option open for now and see if it make sense as the characters and story grow. This may not work for you though, it seems like everyone is different when it comes to writing. My writing is kind of like my life, I pick a general direction and head off and usually I wind up someplace cool though I may not be where I expected to be when the journey was over.

Post Wed Apr 08, 2009 12:06 pm   View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website
Oliverbritten



Joined: 01 Mar 2008
Posts: 119
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chris wrote:
Oliverbritten wrote:
18Rabbit wrote:
Oliverbritten wrote:
chris wrote:
Strangely enough, romance adds tension. I only read the first Harry Potter book, but I remember immediately wondering whether Hermoine (sp?) and Harry or Ron would "like" each other. Same thing with the Golden Compass, she has a best "male" friend, who she goes to the end of the earth to find. We're hard-wired that way. I don't like the way they just tack romances on to movies, and they often don't fit so I wouldnt' go there if it doesn't seem natural for your character, but finding a companion or mate is very often a part of character motivation, and can work to add a lot of tension to a story. Understand that as a mechanism, romance works better if it's about the pursuit. Nothing kills a TV series as quickly as the two main characters getting together, and often the writers will have to break them up again and again. (Dr. Who and Rose never really "hook up", but their adventure is certainly a romantic one.) Tom Sawyer has a "love interest" in Becky Thatcher. Huckleberry Finn doesn't. Huckleberry Finn is the better book.

If it will add to the effect of the story, then pursue it. With "kid" characters, it can be a lot more clean and pure and unstated, than it is with adult characters. It might not even be "a romance", but a stealthy romantice interest. It's all about satisfying the reader and serving the story you want to tell.


One of my problems with having any kind of romance in this story, is that not only have vampire romance stories been done before but one focused around kids has been done not too long ago. That isn't going to stop me writing the story, but I think having the relationship between the 2 characters who have a slight hint of romance even if it is innocent be one that is only hinted at and more ambiguous. Kinda like the first harry potter book like you said with Hermione. If I was to include the romance part I wonder if having the girl vampire start out as a vampire and a character at the start of the story would have more or less of an impact compared to if she starts out as a human girl who is turned by one of the kids. I really don't want it to seem thrown in just because vampire romance is popular. To make my story different I would probably have to have something in the relationship that makes it different compared to the others.

I think you worry too much about what other people have written. Tell your characters story and be true to them and sod the rest.


I would still write the story even it was too similar to something else. The only reason I am thinking of similarities is not because of what people think of the quality of the story, more how it is received by the people who could publish it once I get it done. Then again I dont know what those people usually think having had no experience with them so I probably am worrying too much. I also would like something in the relationship between characters to be a bit different not because of what people would think really, its more that I would find it more personally compelling to write. Then again if I can't think of anything too different then I will just write what works for me.



Oliver, I know you're striving for originality, but publishers almost never reject something because they've "seen it before". They often reject things because they haven't. Sad but true. Just write the best story you can. Think only of the integrity of YOUR story.

Are you actually writing this, or thinking about writing it?


I am writing this one, I just like to have an idea plot of what I am writing even if I change things later on. Took me a while to really focus on a story I found compelling to write, I actually have a notebook of mostly unused ideas. this time though I am doing something with an idea.

Post Wed Apr 08, 2009 12:27 pm   View user's profile Send private message
Oliverbritten



Joined: 01 Mar 2008
Posts: 119
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18Rabbit wrote:
As the characters grow and reveal themselves to you (at least that's how it is when I write), the relationship will become more clear to you. If I were in your place I would leave the option open for now and see if it make sense as the characters and story grow. This may not work for you though, it seems like everyone is different when it comes to writing. My writing is kind of like my life, I pick a general direction and head off and usually I wind up someplace cool though I may not be where I expected to be when the journey was over.


That is pretty similar to how I write actually, I start somewhere with an idea and it usually ends up being something I didn't expect. Heck most of my best ideas come to me at random times during the day. This vampire idea came because I had just seen that film let the right one in, and my science teacher was talking to me about Oliver Twist. I guess the idea just grew from there.

Post Wed Apr 08, 2009 12:31 pm   View user's profile Send private message
mllefifi



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Maybe you can title the story "An Unnecessary Romance."
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Post Wed Apr 08, 2009 1:23 pm   View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website AIM Address
girlEgirl



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romance is dumb!
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Post Wed Apr 08, 2009 10:17 pm   View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail
Lauren



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chris wrote:
Oliver, I know you're striving for originality, but publishers almost never reject something because they've "seen it before". They often reject things because they haven't. Sad but true. Just write the best story you can. Think only of the integrity of YOUR story.


Ayep, Chris is pretty dead-on there. When one book succeeds, you'll see all sorts of similar-feeling titles cropping up. Hell, Eragon kicked off this spate of fantasy novels written by people too young to buy cigarettes or porn. They were pretty much all as sucktastic as Paolini's clusterfuck with dragons, too.
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Post Thu Apr 09, 2009 8:02 am   View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Visit poster's website AIM Address ICQ Number
sugarraydodge



Joined: 27 Nov 2007
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girlEgirl wrote:
romance is dumb!


Second!
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Post Thu Apr 09, 2009 12:55 pm   View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website AIM Address
Oliverbritten



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This doesn't have anything to do with romance, but I was in the middle of writing today when I thought of a character who could be really interesting. Usually vampires get blood by biting people who then get infected, well I thought that an interesting character in relation to that would be someone who is a sort of walking blood bank for the vampire kids. He offers his own blood by using syringes and such to get it then gives it to them without needing to have them bite him. I'm sure the no biting thing has been done before, in fact I remember it from that really underrated vampire film Near Dark, but to have a character like this who thinks he is just good for the blood he supplies could be interesting character development wise.

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