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Altruism or a Guilty Conscience?
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Amigo



Joined: 25 Aug 2006
Posts: 2499
Altruism or a Guilty Conscience?  Reply with quote  

Americans Set Record for Donations in 2006
By VINNEE TONG, AP Business Writer

Mon Jun 25, 0:31 AM

NEW YORK - Americans gave nearly $300 billion to charitable causes last year, setting a new record and besting the 2005 total that had been boosted by a surge in aid to victims of hurricanes Katrina, Rita and Wilma and the Asian tsunami.

[...]

Gaudiani said Americans give twice as much as the next most charitable country, according to a November 2006 comparison done by the Charities Aid Foundation. In philanthropic giving as a percentage of gross domestic product, the U.S. ranked first at 1.7 percent. No. 2 Britain gave 0.73 percent, while France, with a 0.14 percent rate, trailed such countries as South Africa, Singapore, Turkey and Germany.[...]

Obviously, in France, egoism rules the day. Cannot say I'm surprised. Rolling Eyes

Post Mon Jun 25, 2007 3:58 am   View user's profile Send private message
Notdeadyet



Joined: 23 Nov 2006
Posts: 4056
Location: Midwest
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O.K., so I'm wondering about tax law in France now.... Cool
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Post Mon Jun 25, 2007 3:03 pm   View user's profile Send private message
Ferrit Leggings



Joined: 29 Mar 2004
Posts: 2658
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You see there is less need for charity when government actually helps people.
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Post Mon Jun 25, 2007 9:15 pm   View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Visit poster's website
fortune cookie



Joined: 18 Mar 2006
Posts: 10534
Location: Easy street
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Are you saying we should start living up to other countries views of us
and stop being so damn generous?
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Post Mon Jun 25, 2007 11:08 pm   View user's profile Send private message
Amigo



Joined: 25 Aug 2006
Posts: 2499
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Ferrit Leggings wrote:
You see there is less need for charity when government actually helps people.


fortune cookie wrote:
Are you saying we should start living up to other countries views of us
and stop being so damn generous?


Interesting responses.

First, the last I heard, France has plenty of problems that could be alleviated by more charitable giving:

"Although France occupies an average position in terms of European levels of general poverty, the rate of child poverty is above average for the EU." (here)

However, I think the relatively high tax rates there build at least an expectation that, indeed, the government will, or should, be helping the poor and downtrodden.

Second, my "Altruism or Guily Conscience" thread title was meant to be very much tongue-in-cheek. I am very proud of how charitable Americans are, and also glad that we don't have the "socialized everything" mind-set that exists in much of Europe.

Post Tue Jun 26, 2007 1:24 am   View user's profile Send private message
Notdeadyet



Joined: 23 Nov 2006
Posts: 4056
Location: Midwest
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But how charitable are we really? It would depend....
I would want to see the accounting....
For example, If a Dow Corning exec gives 3,000 a year to the MSSC (non-profit speedsk8 club) and the MSSC turns around and only charges 200 a year per kid for ice time practice for his kids and he gets to write off the 3,000 is that charitable giving? Well yeah, in the U.S.
Conversely, a group of moms affiliated through our speedskating club became aware of a young lady and her mentally impaired sister and the sister's two year old who were kicked out of a battered woman's shelter (and rightfully so) because the mentally impaired 18 year old invited some drunk men back to her room there. Consequently they were dropped off in an empty rental unit with one month's rent paid and a small box of food from the food bank and not even a can opener in the apartment to open the food. People scrambled and came up with used furniture, clothing, kitchen utensils, stroller, lawn mower, etc. Then two ladies visit several times a week to see what they need and how things are going. All the stuff we came up with was stuff nobody was using anyway and cash out cost was probably less than 1/6 of the 3,000 write off.........but it will never count on any government statistic as charitable giving.
In the long run it may keep the two year old out of foster care, maybe not, but at least for now.
So, one of the ladies that goes over there has her doctorate, in practice she charges hundreds an hour for family therapy. Obviously, her time is donated.
These are the things I wonder about. How are France's tax laws, how do they count charitable giving, what about the things that can't be counted? I'll bet the French do a lot more, but maybe their system of accounting is different. You can't compare apples and oranges....themn there is the corporate matching, I don't know if they have that there either......... Rolling Eyes

2004 article about how France is considering changing their tax laws for more incentive for charitable giving and bringing law into line with other EU nations.
http://philanthropy.com/premium/articles/v15/i12/12001103.htm

from here
http://www.generousgiving.org/page.asp?sec=28&page=278

Note that 62% of charitable giving in U.S. is to religious organizations....
that would not count speedsk8ing as we aren't considered a religion yet Twisted Evil
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Post Tue Jun 26, 2007 6:28 am   View user's profile Send private message
Ferrit Leggings



Joined: 29 Mar 2004
Posts: 2658
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fortune cookie wrote:
Are you saying we should start living up to other countries views of us
and stop being so damn generous?



I am sorry, I forgot that the US is the perfect model of democracy and I shouldn't have stepped out of line. Mental note to tow the line, wave my flag, and impale myself on it.

I am not saying that we should be less generous, I am saying that if we had a government for the people and not just for the upper ten percent maybe we wouldn't have to be so damn generous.
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Post Tue Jun 26, 2007 11:55 am   View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Visit poster's website
Aubie



Joined: 17 Jan 2006
Posts: 1428
Location: Bammer
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Don't forget they're for the bottom 20 percent as well, leaving us middle, tax burden mules in 60 percent limbo. Wink
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Post Tue Jun 26, 2007 12:29 pm   View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website
dougp



Joined: 25 Feb 2006
Posts: 2038
Location: right behind you
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Oh how, oh how did the down trodden ever get by before the government decided to coddle them?
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Post Tue Jun 26, 2007 2:17 pm   View user's profile Send private message
Aubie



Joined: 17 Jan 2006
Posts: 1428
Location: Bammer
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Well, I should rephrase that as the 15 percent who ruin and take advantage of benefits for the people who truly need it.
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It's pronounced Aw-Bee if you were wonderin.

Post Tue Jun 26, 2007 3:26 pm   View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website
Ferrit Leggings



Joined: 29 Mar 2004
Posts: 2658
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Don't worry you who are in the middle class will soon join us down trodden souls in the lower class it will just take a bit longer, probably when you reach old age and need to go into a nursing home. The home will suck all of your cash from insurance and retirement then they will go for your bank accounts when that is done expect a one way ticket to skid row.


Doug, the down trodden are just the same as they were a hundred years ago. People kept stupid and happy until happy goes away with a kick in the ass.

Can I ask what is wrong with expecting the government to provide quality education and healthcare? Hell, who cares if it is quality at this point as long as it is a rusty needle with shot of morphine.

BTW: The Associated Press are nothing but a bunch of fucktards fucking a fucksock. If I recall they were the first to go on the no Paris Hilton coverage, which lasted about three days. CNN jumped on the bandwagon of coming out of Paris but they decided to not cover her by covering her jail time while complaining about it. Then Fox did it up like a hooker on Penn Ave with updates by the hour and Billy O specials on topic. I am surprised Nancy Grace didn't phone her up and give her suicidal thoughts. That could be why she tried to get out on "Medical". Probably tried to top herself by strangling herself with the elastic of her own panties but like in real life it kept slipping off.

Also, America is a country of weak minded and bodied people that fuck and eat like it is the seventies and Richard Nixon is in the white-house. Right now we have the equivalent of Dick's little brother that rode the short bus to school but it is all an act because he is laughing, just like all the other rich assholes, all the way to Dubai. What do we do about it? Not a goddamn thing. We sit around and quibble about evolution, gay marriage, Paris in jail, and so on, and so on. No Bush is not stupid. He is just counting on the fact that most Americans are stupid because they are the ones that got him elected, twice. Watch out and Rudy will get elected. That guy looks like Nosferatu bringing twice the amount of death his predecessor did.

Meanwhile the French are laughing their asses off too. They are laughing at us and our ability to take an ass fucking from our government while punching our time clocks and bending our knees to a regime of both demoncrats and rebpubofucks that are lubing us up for another one.

Imagine getting sick and not worrying about the cost.
Imagine calling into sick without worry of sick days.
Imagine having more than one week vacation.
Imagine not having to worry about things that no one should have to worry about.

Now Imagine how many news stations that are going to cover Paris' getting out of jail, or some fat kid that shot a huge pig in his fenced backyard, or the school teacher getting a sex change, or how much better freedom fries are, or whatever else it is that is placating the masses these days.

Cheers,
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Post Tue Jun 26, 2007 5:53 pm   View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Visit poster's website
Notdeadyet



Joined: 23 Nov 2006
Posts: 4056
Location: Midwest
 Reply with quote  

I want to go see the Candide at La Scala.... Cool

They say the bit about pedophile priests was cut, however the portion where there is a trial and Candide is tried for expressing individual thought and the judges wear the KKK robes and denounce Jews, Homosexualites, and Communists as thwarting America was left in.... also you get to see a George Bush in his underwear dancing...

http://www.theglobeandmail.com/servlet/story/RTGAM.20070620.wcandide20/BNStory/Entertainment/Music/
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Post Tue Jun 26, 2007 6:47 pm   View user's profile Send private message
Tito



Joined: 30 Mar 2004
Posts: 1203
Location: is everything
 Reply with quote  

buh-bye.

Last edited by Tito on Tue Jul 06, 2010 1:43 pm; edited 1 time in total

Post Tue Jun 26, 2007 8:42 pm   View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website
fortune cookie



Joined: 18 Mar 2006
Posts: 10534
Location: Easy street
 Reply with quote  

Ferrit Leggings wrote:
fortune cookie wrote:
Are you saying we should start living up to other countries views of us
and stop being so damn generous?



I am sorry, I forgot that the US is the perfect model of democracy and I shouldn't have stepped out of line. Mental note to tow the line, wave my flag, and impale myself on it.

I am not saying that we should be less generous, I am saying that if we had a government for the people and not just for the upper ten percent maybe we wouldn't have to be so damn generous.


Sorry guys, forgot my LOL Emoticon.

As for how I feel about our nations "delicate condition".
I love my country, it's my government I want to kill. Razz
_________________
We all enter this world in the same way: naked; screaming; soaked in blood.
But if you live your life right, that kind of thing doesn't have to stop there." Dana Gould

Post Tue Jun 26, 2007 10:51 pm   View user's profile Send private message
Amigo



Joined: 25 Aug 2006
Posts: 2499
 Reply with quote  

Ferrit Leggings wrote:
Don't worry you who are in the middle class will soon join us down trodden souls in the lower class it will just take a bit longer, probably when you reach old age and need to go into a nursing home. The home will suck all of your cash from insurance and retirement then they will go for your bank accounts when that is done expect a one way ticket to skid row.


Doug, the down trodden are just the same as they were a hundred years ago. People kept stupid and happy until happy goes away with a kick in the ass.

Can I ask what is wrong with expecting the government to provide quality education and healthcare? Hell, who cares if it is quality at this point as long as it is a rusty needle with shot of morphine.

BTW: The Associated Press are nothing but a bunch of fucktards fucking a fucksock. If I recall they were the first to go on the no Paris Hilton coverage, which lasted about three days. CNN jumped on the bandwagon of coming out of Paris but they decided to not cover her by covering her jail time while complaining about it. Then Fox did it up like a hooker on Penn Ave with updates by the hour and Billy O specials on topic. I am surprised Nancy Grace didn't phone her up and give her suicidal thoughts. That could be why she tried to get out on "Medical". Probably tried to top herself by strangling herself with the elastic of her own panties but like in real life it kept slipping off.

Also, America is a country of weak minded and bodied people that fuck and eat like it is the seventies and Richard Nixon is in the white-house. Right now we have the equivalent of Dick's little brother that rode the short bus to school but it is all an act because he is laughing, just like all the other rich assholes, all the way to Dubai. What do we do about it? Not a goddamn thing. We sit around and quibble about evolution, gay marriage, Paris in jail, and so on, and so on. No Bush is not stupid. He is just counting on the fact that most Americans are stupid because they are the ones that got him elected, twice. Watch out and Rudy will get elected. That guy looks like Nosferatu bringing twice the amount of death his predecessor did.

Meanwhile the French are laughing their asses off too. They are laughing at us and our ability to take an ass fucking from our government while punching our time clocks and bending our knees to a regime of both demoncrats and rebpubofucks that are lubing us up for another one.

Imagine getting sick and not worrying about the cost.
Imagine calling into sick without worry of sick days.
Imagine having more than one week vacation.
Imagine not having to worry about things that no one should have to worry about.

Now Imagine how many news stations that are going to cover Paris' getting out of jail, or some fat kid that shot a huge pig in his fenced backyard, or the school teacher getting a sex change, or how much better freedom fries are, or whatever else it is that is placating the masses these days.

Cheers,


And despite all this you're still an American citizen?! Shocked

Post Wed Jun 27, 2007 3:27 am   View user's profile Send private message
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