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What is the point of a Presidential pardon????
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Notdeadyet



Joined: 23 Nov 2006
Posts: 4056
Location: Midwest
What is the point of a Presidential pardon????  Reply with quote  

O.K., all you political science majors...
explain it to me...
what is the point... balance of power yadadadada, I took government, but seriously, why is it an executive privilege.
what point does it serve.
Why can't we make it die?
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/19571706/
it doesn't really appear to me to be doing anything useful..... Rolling Eyes
Apparently it has to do with the fourth paragraph in the below link... I still don't get it as it applies here...
http://www.constitution.org/fed/federa74.htm
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Post Wed Jul 04, 2007 9:27 pm   View user's profile Send private message
Butch the Vizsla



Joined: 12 Sep 2006
Posts: 558
Location: Branford, CT
 Reply with quote  

One of the original uses of the presidential pardon was after the American revolution, as a sort of free pass to loyalists.

In modern times, most pardons are politically motivated.

Why the president still has this power, technically, is part of the system of checks and balances, but it's rarely used in a strictly humanitarian sense.
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Post Sat Jul 07, 2007 3:28 pm   View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website
Notdeadyet



Joined: 23 Nov 2006
Posts: 4056
Location: Midwest
 Reply with quote  

O.K., so like to pardon the Whiskey rebellion people, that I got.
Why is it still here????
Do we need it??
Has it served any useful purpose since, oh say, the Nixon administration?
Didn't a jury of Libby's peers convict him of obstruction of justice?
A guy I know is a doctor, and he was in the service, but he still got in trouble with drugs....
His offense was actually seen as being worse, in the sense that he of all people should have known the devastation his behavior caused.....
I 'm kind of the opinion that Scooter Libby shouldn't be given a pass because of his service to the country, he ought to be held more accountable for his actions........
Seriously, what does this particular power of the president balance out? Evil or Very Mad
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Post Sat Jul 07, 2007 8:08 pm   View user's profile Send private message
Ginjg



Joined: 04 Sep 2004
Posts: 6617
Location: Los Angeles
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The things people get pardoned for are amazing. Money Laundering, selling National Security info, drug trafficking, bootlegging,embezzlement, conspiracy, and all manner of things

And it's across the board Republican and Democrat. Truman, Eisenhower & Johnson granted the most. Presidents are magnanimous.

We're hearing the neocon press saying "Well Clinton pardoned Mark Rich and Susan McDougal" in response to the outcry about the Libby commutation. All the while forgetting that Papa Bush, though granting far fewer pardons than most presidents, did pardon his good buddies Casper Wineberger, former Secretary of Defense; Elliott Abrams, a former assistant secretary of state for Inter-American affairs; former National Security Adviser Robert McFarlane; and Duane Clarridge, Alan Fiers, and Clair George, all former employees of the Central Intelligence Agency. Some had pleaded guilty, some had been indicted and Some already convicted in connection with the Iran-Contra arms-for-hostages investigation. One of GHWB's very first pardons was Armand Hammer for his campaign fund laundering during the Nixon era - Reagan had turned down the same pardon just months before. I'm sure there was no connection to Hammer's donations of $100,000 to the RNC and the same amount to the Bush Quayle inaugural.


As of 6/29/07, W has granted 113 people and commuted 4 sentences. in comparison, Daddy Bush granted 74 in four years; Clinton granted 396 in eight years; Reagan did 393 in eight; Carter did 534 in four. Nixon granted 863, he got one of Gerald Ford's 382 pardons along with Tokyo Rose.
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Post Sat Jul 07, 2007 9:53 pm   View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website AIM Address
fortune cookie



Joined: 18 Mar 2006
Posts: 10534
Location: Easy street
 Reply with quote  

If dubya is gonna pardon anybody, it ought to be the two border guards,
currently rotting in prison for doing their job.

But that would be the proper thing to do, wouldn't it?
Can't start doing that, this far down the line, can we?
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Post Sat Jul 07, 2007 10:11 pm   View user's profile Send private message
Ginjg



Joined: 04 Sep 2004
Posts: 6617
Location: Los Angeles
 Reply with quote  

Aside from Carter's amnesty to the Draft Dodgers (which pushes his number much higher than the official count), I don't remember seeing anything in the pardon lists that come remotely close to as justified as pardoning those two.

I'd lobby for their pardon.

Of course, if it weren't illegal for border guards to do their jobs there wouldn't be a population explosion of illegal residents. Then what would the congress have to argue about? Hell, they'd have to address real issues like infrastructure, housing, education, poverty, and health care. Heaven forfend.
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Post Sat Jul 07, 2007 10:53 pm   View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website AIM Address
fortune cookie



Joined: 18 Mar 2006
Posts: 10534
Location: Easy street
 Reply with quote  

A body of the government that Actually accomplishes
making the country a better place for it's citizens?
They'd be run out of D.C. on a rail!
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Post Sat Jul 07, 2007 11:15 pm   View user's profile Send private message
Notdeadyet



Joined: 23 Nov 2006
Posts: 4056
Location: Midwest
 Reply with quote  

fortune cookie wrote:
If dubya is gonna pardon anybody, it ought to be the two border guards,
currently rotting in prison for doing their job.

But that would be the proper thing to do, wouldn't it?
Can't start doing that, this far down the line, can we?


FC put that article back up again about that please.....
Is this it?
http://www.eagleforum.org/column/2007/jan07/07-01-03.html
http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,250574,00.html
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Post Sun Jul 08, 2007 9:22 am   View user's profile Send private message
Notdeadyet



Joined: 23 Nov 2006
Posts: 4056
Location: Midwest
 Reply with quote  

http://ruthtalks.wordpress.com/2007/01/19/pardon-me-and-pardon-our-border-guards/

Hey, the link above has an email address and a phone number to the whitehouse in order to leave comments for W....
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Post Sun Jul 08, 2007 9:31 am   View user's profile Send private message
deb



Joined: 08 Mar 2004
Posts: 6325
Location: Montana
 Reply with quote  

Mark Rich's lawyer was Scooter Libby. I love irony.
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Post Sun Jul 08, 2007 12:11 pm   View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail
fortune cookie



Joined: 18 Mar 2006
Posts: 10534
Location: Easy street
 Reply with quote  

Notdeadyet wrote:

FC put that article back up again about that please.....
Is this it?
http://www.eagleforum.org/column/2007/jan07/07-01-03.html
http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,250574,00.html


That would be correct.

Gads! This really chaps my hind end.
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Post Sun Jul 08, 2007 2:09 pm   View user's profile Send private message
Butch the Vizsla



Joined: 12 Sep 2006
Posts: 558
Location: Branford, CT
 Reply with quote  

Regarding this action, Keith Olbermann said it nicely:

http://www.commanddotcom.com/2007/07/05/go-keith/
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Post Tue Jul 10, 2007 10:08 am   View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website
dougp



Joined: 25 Feb 2006
Posts: 2038
Location: right behind you
 Reply with quote  

deb wrote:
Mark Rich's lawyer was Scooter Libby. I love irony.



More irony for you. Dubya is a direct decendant of Franklin Pierce, by way of his momma. Many generations later, that tree is still dropping bad apples. Can we get the twins sterilized?
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Post Tue Jul 10, 2007 10:28 am   View user's profile Send private message
deb



Joined: 08 Mar 2004
Posts: 6325
Location: Montana
 Reply with quote  

dougp wrote:
deb wrote:
Mark Rich's lawyer was Scooter Libby. I love irony.



More irony for you. Dubya is a direct decendant of Franklin Pierce, by way of his momma. Many generations later, that tree is still dropping bad apples. Can we get the twins sterilized?


As part of the religion-based policies that government, along with pharmaceutical companies, have created...we can't even get them birth control pills under their insurance policies.
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Post Tue Jul 10, 2007 10:53 am   View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail
fortune cookie



Joined: 18 Mar 2006
Posts: 10534
Location: Easy street
 Reply with quote  

How about a double ott trebel hook in the uterus attached to 60 pound test,
and a great big yank provided by the monster truck Big Foot. Twisted Evil
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We all enter this world in the same way: naked; screaming; soaked in blood.
But if you live your life right, that kind of thing doesn't have to stop there." Dana Gould

Post Tue Jul 10, 2007 7:26 pm   View user's profile Send private message
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