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Revisions (aka--when is the damn thing done?)
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earthshoes



Joined: 17 Jun 2004
Posts: 213
Location: SW Missouri
Revisions (aka--when is the damn thing done?)  Reply with quote  

Seems like I could revise anything I write for ever and ever and never get it "perfect". I've read enough (a lot actually) to know that imperfect stories are published all the time. Heck! I've had imperfect stories published (Ten out of ten within the last year and a half). So I know that's not it. But what I don't know is when you look at the book length manuscript and decide "This is it. I've done all that I can do. Let's see what the agents, publishers and readers have to say."

So when do you deem it done? When you've revised it so many times that you hate the sight of it? When a trusted individual tells you so? Is it an instinctive thing (In which case, I may be lacking this particular quality). Or is a confidence thing--which I also seem to struggle with quite a bit?

mary
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Post Thu Aug 11, 2005 7:05 am   View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail AIM Address Yahoo Messenger
Ferrit Leggings



Joined: 29 Mar 2004
Posts: 2658
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Shoes It is never done, we just give up on it.

ta,
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Post Thu Aug 11, 2005 2:35 pm   View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Visit poster's website
earthshoes



Joined: 17 Jun 2004
Posts: 213
Location: SW Missouri
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And then what?


mary
I never give up . . .
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Post Thu Aug 11, 2005 3:36 pm   View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail AIM Address Yahoo Messenger
palmer



Joined: 30 Mar 2004
Posts: 1324
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Who said, "Woks of art are never finished; they are abandoned."?

Post Thu Aug 11, 2005 4:45 pm   View user's profile Send private message
deb



Joined: 08 Mar 2004
Posts: 6325
Location: Montana
 Reply with quote  

palmer wrote:
Who said, "Woks of art are never finished; they are abandoned."?


Confucious?
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Post Thu Aug 11, 2005 4:46 pm   View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail
Goudron



Joined: 03 Aug 2004
Posts: 2570
Location: near Cleveland OH
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deb wrote:
palmer wrote:
Who said, "Woks of art are never finished; they are abandoned."?


Confucious?


Are you thinking of Yan?
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Post Thu Aug 11, 2005 5:17 pm   View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website
palmer



Joined: 30 Mar 2004
Posts: 1324
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Art is never finished, only abandoned. (Leonardo da Vinci)


More at:

http://www.google.ca/search?hl=en&q=works+of+art+are+never+finished+they+are+abandoned&meta=

Post Thu Aug 11, 2005 5:22 pm   View user's profile Send private message
Guest





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*Wails dramatically**

THIS IS NOT HELPING!!!

Post Thu Aug 11, 2005 6:16 pm   
earthshoes



Joined: 17 Jun 2004
Posts: 213
Location: SW Missouri
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Note: Temper tantrums are more effective when logged in.
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. . .once you are Real you can't be ugly, except to people who don't understand.
(The Velveteen Rabbit)

Post Thu Aug 11, 2005 6:17 pm   View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail AIM Address Yahoo Messenger
palmer



Joined: 30 Mar 2004
Posts: 1324
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When you get it as good as you can get it for how good you are at getting things, more or less.

Then you move on to the next project or you're writing the same book for the rest of your life -- which I think someone did with one that he just couldn't let go of -- Faulkner?

Post Thu Aug 11, 2005 6:24 pm   View user's profile Send private message
Ferrit Leggings



Joined: 29 Mar 2004
Posts: 2658
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There are very few writers that get it right all the time, even Willie Shakespeare gets his share of crap.


Confucius quotes:


He who speaks without modesty will find it difficult to make his words good. (Confucius, Analects)

He with whom neither slander that gradually soaks into the mind, nor statements that startle like a wound in the flesh, are successful may be called intelligent indeed. (Confucius, Analects)

Hold faithfulness and sincerity as first principles. (Confucius, Analects)

I am not one who was born in the possession of knowledge; I am one who is fond of antiquity, and earnest in seeking it there.
(Confucius, Analects)

ta,
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Post Thu Aug 11, 2005 8:02 pm   View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Visit poster's website
JennyO



Joined: 28 Apr 2004
Posts: 2775
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Mary,

If you've had 10 of 10 works published in the past 18 months, I think it's safe to say you're doing something right, and you probably shouldn't worry about it as much. Smile

Jen
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Post Fri Aug 12, 2005 6:00 am   View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website
earthshoes



Joined: 17 Jun 2004
Posts: 213
Location: SW Missouri
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Hi JennyO

Bless you. I meant that ten out of the ten works were imperfect. I have another four or five imperfect stories sitting on my desktop that haven't found anybody who likes them yet.

mary
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. . .once you are Real you can't be ugly, except to people who don't understand.
(The Velveteen Rabbit)

Post Fri Aug 12, 2005 6:30 am   View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail AIM Address Yahoo Messenger
Ferrit Leggings



Joined: 29 Mar 2004
Posts: 2658
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Mary,

You need to stop worry about revisions and fixing things. As long as you have the basics down and donít write horribly then you will be fine. My feeling with writing and any art is that to do it and do it well you have to have heart in it otherwise it will show. In photography it is a photographer that no matter how he or she tries will never be able to capture the nature of the subject. In writing it is a writer that cannot depict his or her characters.

What it comes down to is having some amount of care for what happens to your characters. You may want to kill them off, hurt them somehow in your story but you donít do it without baring it to the reader in a way that makes them understand why. About the only perfect thing is this world is unconditional love. Some people may say that they saw the perfect sunset, had the perfect day and so on but it is usually associated with something else, a person, experience, and so on, that made it perfect. To someone else that perfect sunset meant something completely different and there was nothing perfect about it. It is the writerís job to make the reader know why it was perfect. When it is written down it may not seem perfect but if you get your point across then you did your job. You made someone else understand.

Not all people will be able to get it but that is a risk you have to take. You cannot hold the readers hand and show them everything; they have to figure some out on their own. And there are some writers that are not bothered with details and some that are so perfect that it is sickening. Pablo Neruda, I mentioned him before, his love poems about his wife, to me, were so perfect that it makes me wonder why I would even try to write. Then there is Charles Bukowski and his poems who had a raw unbridled style but you could feel the hope and despair so much that it did not matter if it was perfect. It was beautifully imperfect.

I listen to John McLaughlin play guitar and think that I could never play like that so why bother and then I hear the Sex Pistol play Pretty Vacant and think, ďHeck I can do that.í There is a place for imperfection and a place for perfection. Donít worry about the perfection because to many people perfection means many different things. Make what you write understandable and above all passionate everything else will take care of itself.

Ta,

BTW: I am not a Yankee fan but I like this quote: "It ain't over till it's over." -- Yogi Berra
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I feel the same way about disco as I do about herpes. -HST

Post Fri Aug 12, 2005 3:14 pm   View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Visit poster's website
jaandlu



Joined: 17 Apr 2005
Posts: 4578
Location: Location, location, location.
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earthshoes,
I have only written one thing and that was the Virtual Classroom series. I put them out as I wrote them and not much editing or revision was done. I just did it for the shear joy of writing. I had an idea that I wanted to get across. Some people got it, others didnít. But I laughed my ass off while doing it. What can be better than laughing for like three days straight.

I expect if you are going to sell the thing you will want to spend a little more time on it than I did on VC. Ask yourself, whatís your motivation for writing? I think there you will find the line to draw on your work.

Ja

Post Fri Aug 12, 2005 4:17 pm   View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Visit poster's website
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